Faith schools

the christians were never told not to eat shelfish?

noahide laws.

stick to your islamophobic posts andy, you're out of your depth.

what does that have to do with the debate at hand? I stated that science does not permit one to state something as fact unless he can support that claim.

I'm not defining science, I can read a dictionary for the correct definition... I'm merely commenting on MoS post.

science accepts that there is a lot it doesn't know and can't explain

religion states it's position as fact without giving any proof



just accepting that we don't know everything yet is a much smaller step than saying there's 1 supreme being that created us - thats blatantly human arogance once again

I love it when you attempt to tell me what the torah states, the only laws which govern the gentiles are:

Prohibition of idolatry
Prohibition of blasphemy
Prohibition of murder
Prohibition of theft
Prohibition of illicit relations
Prohibition of eating live meat
Prohibition of failing to establish courts of justice

All the other halakhic laws the Torah speaks of are set aside for the Jew.... Quit while you're behind andy.

Who is being the arrogant one?

Am I dismissing your beliefs?

but the laws in the o...nly testament apply to the jews, the christians know this, its how they were able to ditch the dietry laws and what not.

science vs religion christ what a battle

Religion is full of holes imo and science is only just begining to understand the world and universe around us so neither have a valid claim it would be easier to hold our hand up and say we no bot all at least science is trying to learn rather than basing there claims on stories and ideas that are ever so slightly out of date !

How is it science verse religion... everything science has learnt in recent years compliments what the Jews have been teaching their kids for years.

my PERSONAL beliefs are that religion is bullshit.

the SCIENCE stance is different.

i wouldn't say i'm arogant, intolerant maybe...

I'd say both, with ignorant thrown into the package.

Can you explain the creation of the universe?
Can you explain abiogenesis?
Can you explain how energy manifests itself as matter?
Can you explain the fine tuning of the universe to support life?

If you can't explain any of the above how can you claim one theory is bullshit? You can maybe state that you find it unlikely... but to dismiss it is ignorance of the highest level.

I was meaning on the subject of creation joe .

Religion is a total hoax ! science on the other hand is a valid way of learning more and gaining a better understanding of what is around us .

The religious books are just a bunch of rules written down by men to control other men !

While i do believe there is something else after life or other than life i do not like the many religious leaders and facists pretend to know anything more about it . Pretend being the key word as not a single thing in any religious belief can be proven or dispoven therfore it is simply a theory and can not be trusted !

Can you explain the creation of the universe?No - so MUST it be god? no
Can you explain abiogenesis? ?No - i'm not a scientist specialising in that field. so is god the only other answer?
Can you explain how energy manifests itself as matter?No - i'm not a scientist specialising in that field. so MUST it be by gods hand? no
Can you explain the fine tuning of the universe to support life? fine tuning? don't make me laugh

there's billons of stars, galaxies, solar systems and planets - it's theoretically implausible that among all that SOMETHING wouldn't evolve the way we have. it's chance. Probability is that there's loads more instances of some kind of life in the universe, all evolving in different ways, at different speeds in a million different variations uncomprehendable to us - it's only MANS ARROGANCE that imagines WE'RE the centre of it all, as described stupid, short sighted ill-educated feafull humans a few thousand years ago.

don't be blinded by your religion. we're not alone. we're opened our eyes and seen the possiblity that we're no longer the centre of this universe - we're just an insignificant spec in an insignificant plant a trillion miles from anywhere. accept it.

arrogant? probably i suppose. but then, i don't force my beliefs down peoples throat or try kill people or steal land because of what i live by

I've probably met more holy men than you could care to imagine and I can assure you everyone of them believe in g-d with all their hearts... this isn't a medium for control... Viewing religion as a means control is self projection from the secular community.

You've just stated you can't disprove religion so how can you claim its pretend?

Science can't explain any of the above, all it provides are theories... the same as religion.

"If you change a little bit the laws of nature, or you change a little bit the constants of nature -- like the charge on the electron -- then the way the universe develops is so changed, it is very likely that intelligent life would not have been able to develop. " - Dr. Dennis Scania

"If we nudge one of these constants just a few percent in one direction, stars burn out within a million years of their formation, and there is no time for evolution. If we nudge it a few percent in the other direction, then no elements heavier than helium form. No carbon, no life. Not even any chemistry. No complexity at all." - Dr. David D. Deutsch

"The really amazing thing is not that life on Earth is balanced on a knife-edge, but that the entire universe is balanced on a knife-edge, and would be total chaos if any of the natural 'constants' were off even slightly. You see," Davies adds, "even if you dismiss man as a chance happening, the fact remains that the universe seems unreasonably suited to the existence of life -- almost contrived -- you might say a 'put-up job'."

"The really amazing thing is not that life on Earth is balanced on a knife-edge, but that the entire universe is balanced on a knife-edge, and would be total chaos if any of the natural 'constants' were off even slightly. You see," Davies adds, "even if you dismiss man as a chance happening, the fact remains that the universe seems unreasonably suited to the existence of life -- almost contrived -- you might say a 'put-up job'." - Dr. Paul Davies

"The remarkable fact is that the values of these numbers (i.e. the constants of physics) seem to have been very finely adjusted to make possible the development of life". "For example," Hawking writes, "if the electric charge of the electron had been only slightly different, stars would have been unable to burn hydrogen and helium, or else they would not have exploded. It seems clear that there are relatively few ranges of values for the numbers (for the constants) that would allow for development of any form of intelligent life. Most sets of values would give rise to universes that, although they might be very beautiful, would contain no one able to wonder at that beauty." - Stephen Hawking -A Brief History of Time (p. 125)

Hawking then says that he can appreciate taking this as possible evidence of "a divine purpose in Creation and the choice of the laws of science (by G-d)"


Yeah MoS the universe isn't finely tuned to support life

Just because something exists - does not mean that life will evolve?!?!? If you support evolution theory then you support the notion that the Universe was finely tuned to support life... it is an onwards progression founded on some phenomenal chances (if they are chance).

For example:

hahaha this tops it for me, you tell me not to be blinded by my religion (which you claim is a leap of blind faith), then go onto tell me to accept that the existence of aliens!

What is the belief of aliens if not blind faith?

MoS did i join a thread mocking your beliefs? No.

You're forcing your beliefs down my throat... not vice-versa.

And you cant prove it so how can you say its correct or follow it in the first place

because I believe there is enough evidence to support my belief.

hashem revealed himself to 2 million hebrews (a hard thing to fake before the common era)
the knowledge in the Torah seems far to advanced for its time (modern science is only just catching up)
the eternity of energy within this spacetime continuim correlates with the eternity of the soul within this stage of genesis

There are a million reasons I can cite to support my belief... But more importantl;y I have faith in my belief and faith in my covenant with g-d.

if we come to a conclusion in this thread, we can solve the worlds problems

This board could already solve the worlds problems.

But your eveidence is bull shit you cant prove there were 2 million jews there you cant prove why hashem chose to flash at them and there maybe knowledge in the torah that seems advanced but it proves nothing you can link lots of phrases ans sayings to things that happen now or have been discoverd because thats the religious way 'everything can be explained as an act of God '

Sorry Joe but i dont get how an intelligent person such as yourself can put his faith in something which CAN NOT be taken as truth and HAS NOT any concrete evidence to back it up just a book written by some very clever people along time ago .

maybe god is just well shit, and all the other planets in the universe are gods attempts at trying to create life, but he only managed to get it right on earth.

Not someone i want to worship.