Raver dead

At present though this doesn't exaist - so if I were to grass on my friends now I repeat what good will it do?

but I'll let you run along

not read everything thats been posted before but i do agree with what your saying here 100%!

I don't think it is getting worse - when I was a kid football hooliganism was huge, ram rading was the in thing and boy george dressed like an idiot.

The crimes have changed but the problem hasn't...

To think problem kids are a new thing is possibly the most nieve thing you've ever said... I think all thats happening now is we're turrning on to the fact that betaing our kids wont stop them from misbehaving... Granted on a 7 year old a smacked bot will make him think twice - but we're talking kids between the ages of 11 and 19, Juski wake the fuck up... pulling down their trousers turning them over your knee and spanking them will not discipline them but it will get you a jail sentence.

Like you quite rightly pointed out parents are often to blame letting their kids wander the streets till 10pm, however beating the child @ school isn't going to discpline them.. The only way to change someone in that situation is to give them oppertunities... Soime of the roughest rouges I know were reguarly beaten off their parents a child - violence usually breeds violence.

Teach a kid a trade where he can make good money and he'll take up that trade, I fail to see how beating a kid will change his lifestyle. Please enlighten me.

Your missig the point though.

the kids that run a muck on the whole aren't the kids with good parents, they're the ones with bad parents and a teacher giving a kid the slipper aint going to change their parents or the way that child interacts with the rest of the world.

I'm sorry but primary and seocndry school teachers aren't qualified to hit my kids, my entire family (bar julia) went through school under the label problem children - yet we all achieved A's at GCSE level... We all now in very good uni's or very well paid jobs... I fail to see what beating us would of achieved?

I think we're both agreed on the fact that a lot of these problems stem from the home, but a bad parent is a bad parent however much you stamp your foot this isn't going to change... Giving teachers the right to cane kids at school will not change this chjilds outlook on life - he'll still be roaming the streets at 3am.

I can even understand your logic for wanting to discpline these kids... But it dsoesn't change fuck all... You hit a kid he crys, but do u seriously think thats a serious deterrent for them? It just means they'll consider not throwing paper aeroplanes at the teacher.. but even then they'll probably still do it.

corpral punishment just stops the good kids from being bad... and these aren't the problem - these are just michevious school kids... its a childs nature to be mischevious - they don't deserve to be caned for it.

I remember being petried of doing anything wrong when I was little cos I was so scared of Dad. He used to say 'you know whats in the middle draw of the cabinet' (meaning a belt) and that was enough to put me off. I think Mam and Dad had a lot to do with the wy we've turned out because they're decent. If our parents weren't like that me, you and Em would be totally different IMO

For the first time I find myslef agreeing with you

Interesting point is in 22 states corporal punishment is legal in america...

Kodak moment

i'm sure my neighbours who had everything stolen from them when they were burgled earlier this year wud disagree that these ppl are petty criminals.....they had everything stolen when they were at church...family airlooms dating back 175 yrs.....dunno how can you can say its petty crime joe!

also like you amy i was too scared of my dad to do anything wrong.....it did me no harm being brough tup that if you do something wrong you get punished for it.....in fact i wud say i'm a better person for having been taught that!!

in this day and age there's far too many human rights do-gooders, fighting for the rights of criminals and prisoners. My grandad was burgled 3 times in 2 weeks. They caught the lad. he was responibile for 78 other burglaries. He got 3 months in a young offenders, with sky t.v., pool tables, al a carte menus, xboxs and PS2's.... my grandad died last month with a black and white t.v., scared to go to bed and wondering where all his war medals were. If i ever see him, and i know what he looks like, i'll slit his throat and take whatever consequences are thrown at me. Theft is one of the most cowardly crimes. Stealing peoples cars, breaking into peoples houses and taking people possesions. It's envy, jealousy, wanting something other people are prepared to work for. They are scum of the earth - there's no defense for what they do.

Everyone has a choice - it's up to them what they do with it. it's called free will. People choose to commit crime - they should expect the harshest punishment. They should take responsibility for their actions.

Tony Martin was right - he doesn't have the right to kill anyone, but he should have the right to defend himself. What kind of world do we live in where some gypo criminal is able to sue the victim for compensation? I'm sure if i owned a gun, and i found a couple of burglers in my house, taking my stuff, invading my privacy, endangering my family - there would be 2 less criminals for Jack Straw to worry about.

like your grandad (sorry to hear bout that) tony martin had been burgled by fred barras & co b4...this was the 5th time they'd been burgled him.....tis disgusting that he wasn't allowed to defend his own home...cos the police had done fuck all about it!!!!1 we should have laws like america where if you find an intruder in your house you can shoot the fuckers!!!!!

Rufus yet again your intellect amazes me

I'm sorry theft is petty crime, just because someone is on the rob it doesn't make them a cold blooded evil cunt... I couldn't give to shits about your neighbour, slapping a kid in jail for 6 months cos he pinched a couple of stereo's isn't the sollution.

As for corporal punishment I'm sorry but your not a good example hun, your a bar maid from consett... I wouldn't exactly say you've been motivated to go places.

What on earth do you think you teach a child when a fully grown adult bends it over and beats it with a strap/paddle/slipper/cane you certainly don't teach it rgiht from wrong, all you teach the child is that to be in charge you have to phycially force someone into submission... In consett that may be the done thing - but I certainly don't want my child learning those values and I would never want my child to think that violence is the answer.

In todays society we don't solve our problems with violence and as kids learn from our examples what message do you think we're putting out. I also haven't even touched on the psychological trauma a child goes through when an authority external to its family beats it... It can have serious long term psychological effects like long-lasting anxiety, social withdrawal, night terrors, and severe depression.

Yes you were beat as a child, adults most likely to beat their children were the ones who were beat themselve as a violence often repeats itsself - the only way to break this cycle is if people like yourself wisen up.

You only need to look at America where there are far worse problems with kids than here to realise corporal punishment isn't the answer.

This is a repeat offender though - slapping him in jail isn't going to do anything - call me a do-gooder whatever, the only way in my eyes to stop him terrorising more old people is to present him with an oppertunity where he can leave the lifestyle he's currently leading.

I'm intergued as to what you think the sollution should be (just hope it isn't lock him up and throw away the key)

there's a big difference between a kid nicking a couple of stereos on a friday night when he's 15 and repeat offenders with multiple offences who blatantly steal, rob and burgle for a living.

The point is if u stop the kid at 15 - he doesn't go onto do it at 27.

yet again your twisting of words amaze me joe...at what point did i say my dad beat me??? i think you'll find never......my parents brought me up to know whats right & wrong (stealing is classed as wrong in our house) & if i'd ever stole anything i wud've been punished (my mam/dad wud've shopped me)

the fact i'm a bar maid from consett has fuck all to do with anything joe, next you'll say its cos i'm inbred that i have these views

tbh joe it doesn't surprise me that you don't give 2 shits about my neighbours...the only person you give a shit about you...your ignorance amazes me & i wonder if you would change your views if a relative of yours was burgled & made frightened to be in their own home at night etc......

i've doen enough psychology to know what can result of a child been brought up in certain conditions......

joe i'm a lot wiser than you think i am......& your more narrow minded than you think you are.....your clueless on me & my family so don't jump to conclusions about me or any of them....

u reckon putting some 30 year old offender, whos' been offending for 15 years , into a 'computer training course' is going to do fuck all? for 1st offences and a few convictions, i don't think jail is the answer - i'm all for rehabilition, getting them out of the routine and the situation where they find themselves where the only opportunity is to commit crime. But persistent, multiple offence criminals have choosen to do what they do. Time after time they offend. At some point u have to draw the line. You can't tell them what to do. They've choosen that path - fair enough. Accept the consequences of their actions. They should be banged up.

i think we're arguing about the same point, but from different angles!

lol hun I live in a affluent area - we've been robbed 3 times. You assume to much.

MoS to an extent I agree - up until this point we've mainly been talking about young car thieves and stuff... if you've got an adult of 30 robbing everyday - it is an extremely hard cycle to break and learning him a trade probably isn't the way to rehabilitate him.. However I don't think locking him up and forgeting about him is the answer...

this is the million dollar question - what do we do with them? if we could answer that, it could solve a lot of societies problems.

all this typing b4 10am is giving me RSI. i'm off for a tab and a brew.

for those of you interested Erwin James was serving a life sentance and rights bi-weekly for the guardian. his column is always fascinating, and this was one of the most powwerful pieces he wrote, so much it was even quoted by politicians in parliament.

http://society.guardian.co.uk/crimeandpunishment/story/0,8150,431163,00.html

does prison really work?